Why should we increase the minimum wage? - Higher paid employee's, work harder.

by Tiny

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10-14-2015, 10:10 PM (This post was last modified: 10-14-2015, 10:20 PM by Tiny.)
#22510 (1)


The information I want you to listen to starts at 1m10s into the video.

There was a conversation I was involved with a little bit ago, involving minimum wage. Now I don't want to make this about voting for anyone in particular I just want to talk about the wage's.

In the Democratic debate Bernie Sanders says he's going to increase the minimum wage to 15$ an HOUR.

You might say "Wouldn't that decrease jobs?", "The value of dollar would decrease, wouldn't it?", "Tons of small business's would collapse?".

Trickle-down economics is as predictable as the laws of physics.

"High hourly wages mean nothing to a worker if he has no job," Southern States Industrial Council cautioned in 1938. I think it should be he/she, but it's a quote from 1938, so let's not go there.

Some make the argument "Extending the minimum wage to restaurants would result in immediate unemployment." The federal minimum wage jumped from 40 cents an hour in 1949 to 75 cents in 1950, an 88-percent increase over just one year. Unemployment plummeted, from 5.9 percent in 1949 to 2.9 percent in 1953. Washington raised the minimum wage for tipped workers by 85 percent between 1988 and 1990 — and over the following decade restaurant employment growth somehow managed to outpace the state as a whole.

The obvious answer is people will work harder, no one will swallow their pride for 9 dollars an hour, I sure as hell wouldn't, wouldn't give a damn how young or uneducated I am at the time. Higher paid workers, are more productive, loyal, and reliable. Don't hop on the "higher pay, causes unemployment" bandwagon.

Of course the dollar would be lessened in value, but that is what happens all the time, every day! Think of 25 years ago, how much did things cost then? It's a normal part of life, things go on. Of course our economy "system" is a little fucked up but it's the way it works for now.

Just because working as a cashier isn't meant to support a family, some people have to do it.. (Single parent, going through college, second job, something for the in-between while the company you work for swaps contracts and lays people off and or a back of up plan.)

I have reason to believe that it would make things a whole lot better! Unemployment rates might go down with just this, from the given examples of the past, could it happen again? After Walmart started the 10 dollar wage investment (public knowledge) Walmart's US stores have gone from being 17 percent "Favorable or Acceptable" in February of 2015, to 67 percent. Higher paid employee's tend to give more fucks.

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10-14-2015, 10:15 PM
#22513 (2)
Thank you for your (what should be) common sense. Trickle-down just doesn't work.

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10-14-2015, 10:22 PM
#22515 (3)
(10-14-2015, 10:15 PM)desu Wrote: Thank you for your (what should be) common sense. Trickle-down just doesn't work.

Sorry that I kind of ranted, I normally have a more laid out "What I want" in my head before I type this up, however I just went with what my fingers typed this time.

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10-21-2015, 10:50 AM (This post was last modified: 10-21-2015, 10:51 AM by Lanie.)
#23271 (4)
>>22510

>  You might say "Wouldn't that decrease jobs?", "The value of dollar would decrease,

>  wouldn't it?", "Tons of small business's would collapse?".

I don't believe any of those would happen, at least not in a major way. The problem with the wages being so low is mostly due to high discrepancy between the lowest paid workers and highest paid in a company, for example. Profit just needs to be more equally distributed between everyone. The fact that the majority of the population would have more money to spend, would make the economy grow, especially certain sectors such as services. (Let's face it, if you're struggling to put food on the table for you and/or your family you can't really spend it on quality of life services). Growth promotes investment which creates more jobs.

Small business collapsing is a possibility, as if certain companies are struggling to make a profit with mostly employees on minimum wage, then raising those would make your income negative. But a lot of those situations can be fixed through a different approach in managment and proper support from the state.

Obviously there's the psychological factor such as higher motivation, productivity as you said but I just tried to focus on a macroeconomic impact.
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10-21-2015, 11:52 AM
#23274 (5)
The economy is the crucial point, I suppose. And if the country's as corrupted as Poland is, it's hard to expect an enormous monthly wage. And people tend to accept whatever's going on with no second thoughts... except for the select few not afraid to say it's laughable to be working for x bucks an hour. But it will always gonna happen - if people get more, they will grow accomodated to it, be able to afford a little more... and still want more.

As for the "higher pay, causes unemployment". Here's some stats. Comparison of monthly wages between UK and Poland in 2007-2012.
[Image: 687474703a2f2f7075752e73682f6b536f71692f...382e706e67]

Now, let's take a look at unemployment in said countries in said years.
[Image: 687474703a2f2f7075752e73682f6b536f6d582f...332e706e67]

So, it's bullshit. No matter the minimal wage, no shit's gonna change.

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Tiny
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10-21-2015, 10:09 PM (This post was last modified: 10-21-2015, 10:09 PM by Tiny.)
#23331 (6)
(10-21-2015, 11:52 AM)Kiss of Death Wrote: The economy is the crucial point, I suppose. And if the country's as corrupted as Poland is, it's hard to expect an enormous monthly wage. And people tend to accept whatever's going on with no second thoughts... except for the select few not afraid to say it's laughable to be working for x bucks an hour. But it will always gonna happen - if people get more, they will grow accomodated to it, be able to afford a little more... and still want more.

As for the "higher pay, causes unemployment". Here's some stats. Comparison of monthly wages between UK and Poland in 2007-2012.
[Image: 687474703a2f2f7075752e73682f6b536f71692f...382e706e67]

Now, let's take a look at unemployment in said countries in said years.
[Image: 687474703a2f2f7075752e73682f6b536f6d582f...332e706e67]

So, it's bullshit. No matter the minimal wage, no shit's gonna change.

I personally just think that unemployment isn't a "wage" issue, however in the examples I provided unemployment rates have gone down in the US in those events. I think it does change according to wage's but not something that could be made into an argument. Anyone that tries to fight anyone on it politically is laughable in the first place.

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10-21-2015, 10:13 PM
#23333 (7)
(10-21-2015, 10:50 AM)Lanie Wrote: >>22510

>  You might say "Wouldn't that decrease jobs?", "The value of dollar would decrease,

>  wouldn't it?", "Tons of small business's would collapse?".

I don't believe any of those would happen, at least not in a major way. The problem with the wages being so low is mostly due to high discrepancy between the lowest paid workers and highest paid in a company, for example. Profit just needs to be more equally distributed between everyone. The fact that the majority of the population would have more money to spend, would make the economy grow, especially certain sectors such as services. (Let's face it, if you're struggling to put food on the table for you and/or your family you can't really spend it on quality of life services). Growth promotes investment which creates more jobs.

Small business collapsing is a possibility, as if certain companies are struggling to make a profit with mostly employees on minimum wage, then raising those would make your income negative. But a lot of those situations can be fixed through a different approach in managment and proper support from the state.

Obviously there's the psychological factor such as higher motivation, productivity as you said but I just tried to focus on a macroeconomic impact.

I was only trying to dismiss what you quoted, as people tend to freak out before reading everything. Ripping money away from the people who do the harder job in the company for "equality" is the most coward way to deal with anything like it. Yes, more people that have more money make the economy grow but there's always that "now I have to pay these workers more, guess this candy bar goes up $2's." I don't think it happens all that much, but thinking about it, it could happen, couldn't it? I think if a business struggling, it's going to struggle no matter what they pay their workers. If I worked a cash register for your shitty store, and then you told me you were paying me less because the store itself was struggling, what makes me want to be nice to people and try to not fuck things up?

The psychological factor goes both ways, good and bad. Wouldn't some people get lazy, this is people with free will we are talking about here. I have seen it with my own eyes.

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10-26-2015, 06:37 PM
#23981 (8)
Before I make a solid judgement about minimum wage, I want to first know why you could have a living wage as a gas station attendant in 1975 but not in 2015. Or even 2005. I want to know what changed in those 3 or 4 decades.
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10-26-2015, 07:59 PM
#23990 (9)
In Australia, the minumum wage is considerably higher than the minimum wage in the US.

Having a higher minimum wage means that it's more expensive for companies to employ people in Australia, which means that a lot of them take the cheaper route of outsourcing everything to China, where they can pay everyone with peanuts.

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10-27-2015, 02:05 PM
#24053 (10)
I agree that people should be getting more than they are for the work that they do, but I don't believe that a higher minimum wage is what we should push for. A higher minimum wage would do nothing but bring enough comfort to the working class to make capitalism seem tolerable; it's first-worldism at it's finest. The only way for true change to come about is through an armed revolution of the proletariat, which would be impossible to do if the entire first world were to settle upon an increased wage as reparations for the disadvantages that capitalism creates.

A fifteen dollar minimum wage is nothing more than a bribe to keep the proletariat under capitalism's rule.
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10-27-2015, 02:36 PM
#24057 (11)
Coming from someone whom nearly lost their own home several times whilst not even being in debt, I like it the way it is now. I don't have anything special, and for sure I'm not rolling in money but I'm just a masochist whom would pass out at work after doing all-nighters again and again only to enjoy it.
Ah- by that I mean uhm, like one day I'll look at all I've done and stuff
I dunno. I am young though so...
but its not as if i dont know what im talking about since i do work a lot at school then editing then not getting enough sleep or food so i pass out of the couch 3 days later when i get home
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10-27-2015, 05:17 PM (This post was last modified: 10-27-2015, 07:33 PM by CompaIsMyWaifu.)
#24072 (12)
I'd like to see the minimum wage increased, but I don't think that a mimimum wage of $15/hour as Sanders proposes is necessary for every state. (I'm still voting for him though) I've lived in various parts of the country, and I've seen that each state has its own economy. In pricier areas like California or New York, yeah I think it makes sense to have at least $15/hour because its crazy expensive to live there, $8/hour is just going to leave you starving. But in my home state of Wisconsin I'd be fine with even just $10-$12 minimum. I won't say no to a federal minimum wage of $15/hour, but I won't endorse that number either.

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10-27-2015, 05:29 PM
#24076 (13)
Why not UBI dependant on whether you maintain a job, then do away with the minnimum wage?
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10-28-2015, 09:01 AM
#24129 (14)
(10-27-2015, 05:29 PM)based_bluetawn Wrote: Why not UBI dependant on whether you maintain a job, then do away with the minnimum wage?

Uh no, literally the whole point of Universal Basic Income is that it is, in fact, universal.

We shouldn't force people that don't want to work to work. Then only people that actually want the jobs will get them, and quality will rapidly increase.

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11-25-2015, 08:59 PM
#29483 (15)
(10-28-2015, 09:01 AM)tn5421 Wrote:
(10-27-2015, 05:29 PM)based_bluetawn Wrote: Why not UBI dependant on whether you maintain a job, then do away with the minnimum wage?

Uh no, literally the whole point of Universal Basic Income is that it is, in fact, universal.

We shouldn't force people that don't want to work to work.  Then only people that actually want the jobs will get them, and quality will rapidly increase.

People should be forced to work to enjoy the spoils of first world societies.
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11-28-2015, 03:31 PM
#29699 (16)
I totally agree with some things here but I want to play, so I get up and go to work every morning. I believe it's also said in a country song.

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12-02-2015, 05:01 PM
#30120 (17)
To pay a poor man a rich mans wage is to make a rich man a poor man.

If we raise the minimum wage then the prices will go up and the issues will continue eventually.

I think low minimum wage encourages those whom will put forth effort to put it forth..?
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12-06-2015, 02:57 PM
#30498 (18)
Increasing minimum wage will hardly have any positives.  Small to medium-sized companies will either increase price, cut work hours, or fire employees.  Large-sized companies would just increase prices.  $15 minimum wage will ruin small family businesses that don't make tons of profit.
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12-07-2015, 12:15 AM
#30529 (19)
I've seen some hard working people bust their ass off with two minimum wage jobs just to survive.
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12-07-2015, 04:50 AM
#30542 (20)
>>30529
Well that's because they're meant for high school and college kids
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12-07-2015, 05:48 AM
#30543 (21)
should be scaled to where you live. i.e. places more expensive to live in should have a higher minimum wage than places that aren't

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